Fences do not make good neighbors because they are inanimate objects, and don't do anything.
Fences actually are good on the Mexican border because they keep the people we don't want in out. For example our border fences keep drug dealers and illegal immigrants out. They might still get through but it makes it harder for them to get through. The fences make it easier for us to protect our border, Mexico doesn't seem to be a good neighbor in complying with out immigration policy therefore our fences are good.
Fences do not make good neighbors because they are inanimate objects and they cannot communicate with us. All joking aside, I would say that fences do not make good neighbors. However, one must take into account the situation in which the fence has been placed. For us, the fence is a good idea because we have more leverage over Mexico. Without a fence, we would be overwhelmed by illegal immigration, which would increase crime rates and weaken our economy. This shows that Mexico needs a strong US relationship for economic purposes, while the US does not necessarily need Mexico as much. Therefore, the fence makes our relationship more profitable for the US because it essentially creates a scarcity of immigration, and prevents the problems metioned above without completely destroying all economic ties with Mexico.
I agree with you on most accounts. However, you must acknowledge that immigrants play an important part in our economy. I think they Mexico and the US need each other, but in this case, the fence is a "good neighbor" because the US does not rely on Mexico as much as they rely on us.
Responding to what Tommy said, I agree fully with what you say. Immigrants may be important to the United States but they must come in legally and under due process. Or else we will be overwhelmed with a huge mass of immgration that we can't handle. Also, I agree that fences make bad neighbors because they are inanimate objects.
I believe that fences are sometimes necessary for the protection of a border, in order to ensure that illegal immigration does not occur. However, a heavily guarded border between countries signals distrust, and may strain relationships between countries. In most cases though, fences do make good neighbors.
@Tommy: I would have to disagree with you that the US does not need Mexico in regards to economics and trade. In 2008, the US exported about 136 thousand dollars worth of goods to Mexico, and imported about 210 thousand dollars. While this is very little in comparison to trade done with Canada, this is still significant.
Fences make excellent neighbors when it comes to the issue of the national security for the United States. It becomes necessary to erect a fence when the security and economy of America is at risk. Using a particular group of people such as illegal immigrants provides excellent statistics to use.
According to government statistics 20 million illegal immigrants have entered this country. The problem with this numerical figure is the fact that it is only an estimate. We are unsure about the legality of many citizens living in the United States.
Another independent report estimates that hard working; legal US citizens pay an additional $20,000 a year in federal, state, and local taxes. Children of illegal immigrants are getting free education and health care by simply stealing from our pockets.
Many times illegal immigrants who enter this country and are employed do not receive fair wages and benefits. This leads to the exploitation of many workers.
A border fence would also help with the removal of crime problems in the United States. On average each day 25 innocent legal United States citizens are killed from murders or drunk driving by illegal immigrants.
This figure is highly disturbing. Illegal immigrants have killed 50,000 citizens since 2001. Compared to the current US death toll in Iraq, illegal immigrants have killed 10 times the number of people who have died in Iraq.
Often other nations will criticize the United States on the border security program and the United States Department of Homeland Security.
The President of Mexico, Felipe Calderón once compared a proposed United States border fence to the Berlin Wall.
He was quoted as saying “Humanity committed a grave error by constructing the Berlin wall and I am sure that today the United States is committing a grave error in constructing a wall along our (Mexico’s) northern border.”
Clearly President Calderón cannot make the connection between a wall that was designed to forcefully contain the citizens of a city, in this case East Berlin to a wall which is designed to keep illegal immigrants out.
It appears that President Calderón admits he is aware of the immigration problem between the United States and Mexico and refuses to admit that there are 4,000 Mexican citizens crossing the border each day.
Perhaps the President of Mexico does not understand why we cherish border security so much.
Numerous terrorists who have been caught in the United States have crossed US borders bordering Canada and the United States. Nabil al-Marabh; a high ranking terrorist on the FBI’s most wanted list who was partially responsible for the September 11, 2001 attacks crossed the Canadian border illegally many times.
Gazi Ibrahim Abu Mezer; another terrorist who planned to use WMD’s (Weapons of Mass Destruction) to destroy a New York City subway station crossed the Canadian border over three times without getting caught.
Ahmed Ressam who planned to destroy the Los Angeles Airport crossed the United States-Canada border multiple times bringing explosives and bomb components across.
If these dangerous individuals do not prove their points to the President of Mexico perhaps his own officials will.
Before and after the September 11, 2001 attacks Mexican government officials publicly stated that terrorist groups were operating inside of Mexico. One official was quoted as saying “Spanish and Islamic terrorist groups are using Mexico as a refuge” and “We have in Mexico people linked to terrorism and we are constantly observing unusual immigration flows ... people connected to ETA, Hezbollah and even some with links to Osama Bin Laden,”
So any claim by the government of Mexico that states placing a wall between the United States-Mexico border is a degrading act can be seen as pure lunacy.
A statement that is even more loony is this quote by New York Senator Hillary Clinton which reads “the "counterproductive" fence interferes with "family relations, business relations, recreation, and so much else that makes living along the border, you know, wonderful.”
Senator Clinton here seems to believe that a fence strains both family relations and business relations.
The only family relations which could be strained by a border fence are the relations of illegal immigrants and their families.
The only business relations which could be strained by a border fence are business deals which include the sale or transport of drugs, weapons, and illegal immigrants.
It seems that corrupt President Calderón and Senator Clinton both agree with each other. We should have guns, drugs, and immigrants transported from Mexico to the United States in their eyes.
90% of the cocaine in the United States passes through the unguarded Mexican border.
Similar shocking rates exist with illegal gun trafficking. Approximately 90% of all illegal firearms are trafficked through Mexico.
This problem must be real because the governors of Arizona and New Mexico on many occasions have declared emergency states of emergency.
I do not blame the governors of these states for their actions. Problems exist below the surface.
Tunnels have become a large problem between the United States and Mexico. Over 40 tunnels have been discovered since 9/11 and the list keeps growing.
One tunnel found from San Diego, California to Tijuana, Mexico stretched for over a half of a mile. Unlike the crude tunnels of the Vietcong in Vietnam, these tunnels had running water, electricity, concrete floors, and over 600 pounds of US bound marijuana.
Its not just illegal immigrants the citizens of the United States need to fear. On many occasions Mexican government officials and officers have crossed the border.
Last year Mexican military personal crossed the US border and discovered a border patrol agent. They held him at gunpoint and only left when backup agents were headed to his rescue.
Many Mexican citizens do not see the need to immigrant legally and because of this reason they cross illegally. Legal immigration takes time and money which many of these immigrants don’t have.
Why should the US be responsible for these immigrants? We allow legal immigration if done properly.
As you can see the United States-Mexico border is a hot issue. Citizens who are concerned should contact their local congressmen In Arizona you can contact Harry Mitchell, John McCain, or Jon Kyl.
I am not sure if I completely understand the question, but I will do my best to respond. On a smalller scale, I know from experience that fences do not make good neighbors. When we lived in Michiga, we had no fences or gates in our neighborhoood. The backyards were all connected and everyone got along for the most part.
But the thing is that we must realize that the world doens't necessarily interact with itself like "happy neighbors." In this case, fences actully might make good neighbors. Its a good thing to have fences on the U.S. Mexico border because we need to keep all of the illegal immigrants out of our country. I would rather have a fence there rather than no fence and have illegal immigrants OVERFLOWING into our America.
Responding to Frank's original post. I agree with you that fenses are good on our U.S. / Mexico because without them our country would be a mess. There would be illegals in our country left and right and that could hurt the economy even more than we are hurting now. But I dont completely argue that MExico isn't totally a good neighbor because there are some legal mexicans that enter the U.S. and they are the ones that do the dirty jobs that some Americans would never do.
In response to Priya, the title of the post is “Mexico”. The fences Mrs. Kiser are talking about are border fences.
I would have to disagree with Ajay. The amount of goods you state which are imported and exported are minute amounts. Sealing the border between Mexico and the United States would not economically impact us severely.
Responding to what Ajay said. I agree with you an overly fortified border breeds distrust with out neighbors. If for example we were to put heavy artillery on the border, Mexico would assume we were at war, and would probably strain relations with us. I beleive that a border that is guarded with a fence and guards withs small arms is good, but too much (ie artillery, tanks, APC's is bad). Those should only be deployed to the border in wartime.
Responding to Brandon: You said that sealing the US-Mexican border would not severly damage our economy. I see why you said that, but you must remember how many immigrant workers come to the United States. Our economy, especially in Arizona, has become strongly dependent on these workers.
@Tommy: You kind of contradicted yourself there. In your first post you said that illegal immigration weakens our economy and it is something that we do not want, but you are now saying that our economy has become strongly dependent on them.
I agree with your most recent post that, in southwestern states, we are heavily dependent on immigrant workers for labor.
You do present an interesting point Ajay. Most of America would not notice. Of course in Arizona our unique situation would force us into some changes.
Frank, I believe you have over interpreted Ajay’s last post.
Responding to Tommy. I agree with you that fences do not make good neighbors, but that sometimes they are necessary for the well-being of one of the neighbors. I also think that your point about Mexico needing us more than we need them is a very true point. A support to this point would be that the number of Mexicans that enter the U.S. is a lot higher number than the number of U.S. citizens that enter Mexico.
Well Priya it is not the number of people who come from Mexico to the United States, but more so the number of illegal immigrants coming from Mexico to the United States. I strongly support easy border crossing for foreign citizens. Allowing foreign citizens to come to the United States increases the amount of money we receive from tourism which boosts our economy.
I agree with you the question is hard to understand. And yes it does depend on where you are talking about like with your example of your neighborhood in Michigan.
I think that fences do make good neighbors, because they protect us incase our neighbors aren't so friendly. That way we would persist to live in peace and tranquilty. Another reaason why I think fences make could neighbors is because it acknowledges where one's property ends, and another's begins, so that things are legitimate and fair, as opposed to rampageous.
I agree with Priya that in some cases it is more or less necessary to have fences in order to keep the peace. But I also agree with Brandon, that illegal immigrants who enter the country, are more of a threat when it comes to crossing borderlines.
I think that fences can make good neighbors. With Mexico we are trying to keep people we do not want in out, so they are very good. Fences protect privacy. Without them people could walk right onto your property and damage it. Having a fence with Mexico we keep out the people we do not want in and we can let people we do want in.
@Frank: I agree with you on the fact that with fences we can keep drug dealers and illegal immigrants out of our country. However we leave the Canadian borders unguarded and they can bring over drugs that are illegal here. Its with the marijuana topic we discussed in class. If we are trying to stop drugs from Mexico coming here then why are we not trying to stop drugs from Canada. Your statement also against your first opinion that fences are inanimate objects and do not do anything.
I don't believe fences make good neighbors. When you put a fence up all you're really saying is you don't trust what's around you. You can even take that down to putting a fence up in your backyard...you put the up so that the dog won't get out because you don't trust your dog. Or you put them up so that no one can get in because you don't trust anyone that you don't know coming onto your private property. If we put a fence between Canada and us it's only going to insult them. It won't make them any happier with us because they'll think we don't trust them that we're on guard towards them. That wouldn't make a very happy neighbor.
I disagree. When you put up a fence you are sending a message to the person on the other side of it. It's isn't going to make the other side happy about what you've done. For example, with Mexico. we put the fence up to keep them out..it hasn't really worked. The only way you could really enforce keeping someone out is by threatening them. Even if you did keep them out they're still not good neighbors because they're unhappy therefore they'll hold a grudge against us. And that's only if he fence works, usually it doesn't even work so it's just better to keep them down and keep a happy relationship especially if the fence wasn't even there in the first place, like with Canada.
Elisa, the reason why our border fence system has failed is because we do not have a fence that completely borders the United States-Mexico border. We only have a few fences which run for a mile or two on high immigrant areas. I quote "The border fence is not one continuous structure and is actually a grouping of short physical walls that stop and start, secured in between with "virtual fence" which includes a system of sensors and cameras monitored by Border Patrol Agents."
@Elisa: Don't you want privacy? Fences can insure that. Yes you can say that houses are private enough, but a lot of houses around my area have huge open windows you can see right through. Also with out fences how do you know where your property starts and someone else's stops?
no, fences do not make good neighbors, becasue they are not alive. however in the cituation with mexico, they may be necessary for our way of life. becasue without them we would have to many iliegal imigrants, and then the population in the us would go way up. and then the ecomomy would go way down. so fences may be better neighbos then mexico can be.
rachel :) your piont abotu keeping privacy is absolutly correct. becasue without fences keeping peopel out of trhe US, andyone could just walk in and invade our lives! also i didnt think about how they can help people in, like they could stop criminals from leaving our country to escape!
I agreee with you on the situation between the United States and Mexico and the border. It has gotten out of hand and Mexican officials aren't paying attention to the facts.
In my opinion, it is difficult to distinguish whether or not fences make good neighbors. For instance, the construction of a fence could be a sign of distrust or hostility between neighbors. However, since we are discussing the United States and Mexico, it is my belief that a fence is best (our country’s safety is important). For example, as many people have previously stated, numerous illegal immigrants would be able to pass over into the United States without a care. This could lead to many complications, such as the destruction of our economy and overpopulation in certain areas. In conclusion, although fences could provoke aggression, they are often needed to keep people safe.
Okay, Brandon you win but either..don't you think Mexico or Canada is or would be at least a little bit offended if we put up borders. What is that saying? Basically that we don't trust them. and rachel well of course i want privacy? why wouldn't i? but if i had to choose between the chances of someone invading my privacy...which isn't likely i mean it isn't like canadians are going to storm down and say "hey whats up" randomly. I mean there are other sources of privacy. Plus putting a fence isn't going to stop all people. I mean think of the 300 million we already have here...anyone could. any way back to what i was saying. if i had to choose between a fence and a good relationship with a neighbor. I 'd choose the neighbor. Although it has helped a lot with illegal immigration i still think that an inanimate object isn't going to do much.
Responding to Rebecca’s first comment. I agree with your position when you stated that fences provide safety (I also included this point in my first response). However, the fact that fences distinguish where properties end did not even cross my mind. Thank you for reminding me of this significant reason. I agree with your entire first response.
andy :) i didnt think about how it would depend where the fencae is. that is a very good point, becasue if there was a fence between canade and the u.s. it would be almost pointless, becasue we get along with them so well. so in that case a fence would nto be a goood neighbor.
Responding to Elisa’s last comment. Your last comment was very well stated and I agree with you. You replied to Brandon by saying that the construction of fences would give the impression of distrust (which is exactly what I said in my response so I agree). In addition, Rachel asked if you want privacy. I wanted to let you know that I agree with your clever reply that you would rather have a good relationship with a neighbor than privacy. However, what about illegal immigration due to the lack of those fences (I know you admitted that it helps illegal immigration but I would like to know if you still think that risking our economy is more important than the relationship that we have with Mexico)?
The following websites are sources I forgot to cite.
"AFP: Controversial border fence hot issue in Texas primary." Google. 11 Feb. 2009 http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iCfHOpvN1kc1VDXC3XK6m88gugWA. "Calderon Likens Fence To Berlin Wall, Mexico's President Elect Calls Both ‘Grave’ Errors; Vicente Fox Says Fence Is An ‘Embarrassment’ - CBS News." CBS News - Breaking News Headlines: Business, Entertainment & World News. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/10/26/world/main2130155.shtml. "Cutting the Cocaine Flow | Newsweek Politics | Newsweek.com." Newsweek - National News, World News, Health, Technology, Entertainment and more... | Newsweek.com. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.newsweek.com/id/42437/. "Drug tunnel from Mexico to U.S. found after raids - USATODAY.com." News, Travel, Weather, Entertainment, Sports, Technology, U.S. & World - USATODAY.com. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-06-29-drug-tunnel_n.htm. "Have Terrorists Crossed?: Border security critics assert no terrorist has ever illegally jumped U.S. borders; they would be wrong :: Other Articles ::." The Investigative Project on Terrorism. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.investigativeproject.org/625/have-terrorists-crossed. "Illegal aliens murder 12 Americans daily." WorldNetDaily. 11 Feb. 2009 http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53103. "Numbers of illegal aliens in the U.S. by Fred Elbel - THE AMERICAN RESISTANCE FOUNDATION - Information on immigration counters -." THE AMERICAN RESISTANCE FOUNDATION - a coalition of immigration crime fighters opposing illegal and undocumented immigration, founded by D.A. King. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.theamericanresistance.com/ref/illegal_alien_numbers.html. "Politics and Immigration." U.S. Border Control Home Page: the right place for stopping illegal immigration anddrug smuggling, reforming our border and immigration policies, and restructuring the INS. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.usbc.org/profiles/2004profiles/0904leakinuss.htm. "Washington Times - Border patrol agent held at gunpoint." Washington Times - Politics, Breaking News, US and World News. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/aug/06/soldiers-cross-into-us-hold-guns-to-agent/?page=2. "YouTube - Immigration Hearing 5/10/2007 -- Robert Rector (Heritage)." YouTube - Broadcast Yourself. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYzPU0Qmh-I&NR=1.
42 comments:
Fences do not make good neighbors because they are inanimate objects, and don't do anything.
Fences actually are good on the Mexican border because they keep the people we don't want in out. For example our border fences keep drug dealers and illegal immigrants out. They might still get through but it makes it harder for them to get through. The fences make it easier for us to protect our border, Mexico doesn't seem to be a good neighbor in complying with out immigration policy therefore our fences are good.
Fences do not make good neighbors because they are inanimate objects and they cannot communicate with us. All joking aside, I would say that fences do not make good neighbors. However, one must take into account the situation in which the fence has been placed. For us, the fence is a good idea because we have more leverage over Mexico. Without a fence, we would be overwhelmed by illegal immigration, which would increase crime rates and weaken our economy. This shows that Mexico needs a strong US relationship for economic purposes, while the US does not necessarily need Mexico as much. Therefore, the fence makes our relationship more profitable for the US because it essentially creates a scarcity of immigration, and prevents the problems metioned above without completely destroying all economic ties with Mexico.
@Frank:
I agree with you on most accounts. However, you must acknowledge that immigrants play an important part in our economy. I think they Mexico and the US need each other, but in this case, the fence is a "good neighbor" because the US does not rely on Mexico as much as they rely on us.
Responding to what Tommy said, I agree fully with what you say. Immigrants may be important to the United States but they must come in legally and under due process. Or else we will be overwhelmed with a huge mass of immgration that we can't handle. Also, I agree that fences make bad neighbors because they are inanimate objects.
I believe that fences are sometimes necessary for the protection of a border, in order to ensure that illegal immigration does not occur. However, a heavily guarded border between countries signals distrust, and may strain relationships between countries. In most cases though, fences do make good neighbors.
@Tommy: I would have to disagree with you that the US does not need Mexico in regards to economics and trade. In 2008, the US exported about 136 thousand dollars worth of goods to Mexico, and imported about 210 thousand dollars. While this is very little in comparison to trade done with Canada, this is still significant.
Fences make excellent neighbors when it comes to the issue of the national security for the United States. It becomes necessary to erect a fence when the security and economy of America is at risk. Using a particular group of people such as illegal immigrants provides excellent statistics to use.
According to government statistics 20 million illegal immigrants have entered this country. The problem with this numerical figure is the fact that it is only an estimate. We are unsure about the legality of many citizens living in the United States.
Another independent report estimates that hard working; legal US citizens pay an additional $20,000 a year in federal, state, and local taxes. Children of illegal immigrants are getting free education and health care by simply stealing from our pockets.
Many times illegal immigrants who enter this country and are employed do not receive fair wages and benefits. This leads to the exploitation of many workers.
A border fence would also help with the removal of crime problems in the United States. On average each day 25 innocent legal United States citizens are killed from murders or drunk driving by illegal immigrants.
This figure is highly disturbing. Illegal immigrants have killed 50,000 citizens since 2001. Compared to the current US death toll in Iraq, illegal immigrants have killed 10 times the number of people who have died in Iraq.
Often other nations will criticize the United States on the border security program and the United States Department of Homeland Security.
The President of Mexico, Felipe Calderón once compared a proposed United States border fence to the Berlin Wall.
He was quoted as saying “Humanity committed a grave error by constructing the Berlin wall and I am sure that today the United States is committing a grave error in constructing a wall along our (Mexico’s) northern border.”
Clearly President Calderón cannot make the connection between a wall that was designed to forcefully contain the citizens of a city, in this case East Berlin to a wall which is designed to keep illegal immigrants out.
It appears that President Calderón admits he is aware of the immigration problem between the United States and Mexico and refuses to admit that there are 4,000 Mexican citizens crossing the border each day.
Perhaps the President of Mexico does not understand why we cherish border security so much.
Numerous terrorists who have been caught in the United States have crossed US borders bordering Canada and the United States.
Nabil al-Marabh; a high ranking terrorist on the FBI’s most wanted list who was partially responsible for the September 11, 2001 attacks crossed the Canadian border illegally many times.
Gazi Ibrahim Abu Mezer; another terrorist who planned to use WMD’s (Weapons of Mass Destruction) to destroy a New York City subway station crossed the Canadian border over three times without getting caught.
Ahmed Ressam who planned to destroy the Los Angeles Airport crossed the United States-Canada border multiple times bringing explosives and bomb components across.
If these dangerous individuals do not prove their points to the President of Mexico perhaps his own officials will.
Before and after the September 11, 2001 attacks Mexican government officials publicly stated that terrorist groups were operating inside of Mexico. One official was quoted as saying “Spanish and Islamic terrorist groups are using Mexico as a refuge” and “We have in Mexico people linked to terrorism and we are constantly observing unusual immigration flows ... people connected to ETA, Hezbollah and even some with links to Osama Bin Laden,”
So any claim by the government of Mexico that states placing a wall between the United States-Mexico border is a degrading act can be seen as pure lunacy.
A statement that is even more loony is this quote by New York Senator Hillary Clinton which reads “the "counterproductive" fence interferes with "family relations, business relations, recreation, and so much else that makes living along the border, you know, wonderful.”
Senator Clinton here seems to believe that a fence strains both family relations and business relations.
The only family relations which could be strained by a border fence are the relations of illegal immigrants and their families.
The only business relations which could be strained by a border fence are business deals which include the sale or transport of drugs, weapons, and illegal immigrants.
It seems that corrupt President Calderón and Senator Clinton both agree with each other. We should have guns, drugs, and immigrants transported from Mexico to the United States in their eyes.
90% of the cocaine in the United States passes through the unguarded Mexican border.
Similar shocking rates exist with illegal gun trafficking. Approximately 90% of all illegal firearms are trafficked through Mexico.
This problem must be real because the governors of Arizona and New Mexico on many occasions have declared emergency states of emergency.
I do not blame the governors of these states for their actions. Problems exist below the surface.
Tunnels have become a large problem between the United States and Mexico. Over 40 tunnels have been discovered since 9/11 and the list keeps growing.
One tunnel found from San Diego, California to Tijuana, Mexico stretched for over a half of a mile. Unlike the crude tunnels of the Vietcong in Vietnam, these tunnels had running water, electricity, concrete floors, and over 600 pounds of US bound marijuana.
Its not just illegal immigrants the citizens of the United States need to fear. On many occasions Mexican government officials and officers have crossed the border.
Last year Mexican military personal crossed the US border and discovered a border patrol agent. They held him at gunpoint and only left when backup agents were headed to his rescue.
Many Mexican citizens do not see the need to immigrant legally and because of this reason they cross illegally. Legal immigration takes time and money which many of these immigrants don’t have.
Why should the US be responsible for these immigrants? We allow legal immigration if done properly.
As you can see the United States-Mexico border is a hot issue. Citizens who are concerned should contact their local congressmen In Arizona you can contact Harry Mitchell, John McCain, or Jon Kyl.
I am not sure if I completely understand the question, but I will do my best to respond. On a smalller scale, I know from experience that fences do not make good neighbors. When we lived in Michiga, we had no fences or gates in our neighborhoood. The backyards were all connected and everyone got along for the most part.
But the thing is that we must realize that the world doens't necessarily interact with itself like "happy neighbors." In this case, fences actully might make good neighbors. Its a good thing to have fences on the U.S. Mexico border because we need to keep all of the illegal immigrants out of our country. I would rather have a fence there rather than no fence and have illegal immigrants OVERFLOWING into our America.
Responding to Frank's original post. I agree with you that fenses are good on our U.S. / Mexico because without them our country would be a mess. There would be illegals in our country left and right and that could hurt the economy even more than we are hurting now. But I dont completely argue that MExico isn't totally a good neighbor because there are some legal mexicans that enter the U.S. and they are the ones that do the dirty jobs that some Americans would never do.
In response to Priya, the title of the post is “Mexico”. The fences Mrs. Kiser are talking about are border fences.
I would have to disagree with Ajay. The amount of goods you state which are imported and exported are minute amounts. Sealing the border between Mexico and the United States would not economically impact us severely.
Responding to what Ajay said. I agree with you an overly fortified border breeds distrust with out neighbors. If for example we were to put heavy artillery on the border, Mexico would assume we were at war, and would probably strain relations with us. I beleive that a border that is guarded with a fence and guards withs small arms is good, but too much (ie artillery, tanks, APC's is bad). Those should only be deployed to the border in wartime.
Responding to Brandon:
You said that sealing the US-Mexican border would not severly damage our economy. I see why you said that, but you must remember how many immigrant workers come to the United States. Our economy, especially in Arizona, has become strongly dependent on these workers.
@Tommy: You kind of contradicted yourself there. In your first post you said that illegal immigration weakens our economy and it is something that we do not want, but you are now saying that our economy has become strongly dependent on them.
I agree with your most recent post that, in southwestern states, we are heavily dependent on immigrant workers for labor.
You do present an interesting point Ajay. Most of America would not notice. Of course in Arizona our unique situation would force us into some changes.
Frank, I believe you have over interpreted Ajay’s last post.
Responding to Tommy. I agree with you that fences do not make good neighbors, but that sometimes they are necessary for the well-being of one of the neighbors. I also think that your point about Mexico needing us more than we need them is a very true point. A support to this point would be that the number of Mexicans that enter the U.S. is a lot higher number than the number of U.S. citizens that enter Mexico.
Well Priya it is not the number of people who come from Mexico to the United States, but more so the number of illegal immigrants coming from Mexico to the United States. I strongly support easy border crossing for foreign citizens. Allowing foreign citizens to come to the United States increases the amount of money we receive from tourism which boosts our economy.
I think it depends on the situation. If it is like the case of the United States and Mexico a fence does make a good neighbor.
@ Priya,
I agree with you the question is hard to understand. And yes it does depend on where you are talking about like with your example of your neighborhood in Michigan.
I think that fences do make good neighbors, because they protect us incase our neighbors aren't so friendly. That way we would persist to live in peace and tranquilty. Another reaason why I think fences make could neighbors is because it acknowledges where one's property ends, and another's begins, so that things are legitimate and fair, as opposed to rampageous.
I agree with Priya that in some cases it is more or less necessary to have fences in order to keep the peace. But I also agree with Brandon, that illegal immigrants who enter the country, are more of a threat when it comes to crossing borderlines.
I think that fences can make good neighbors. With Mexico we are trying to keep people we do not want in out, so they are very good. Fences protect privacy. Without them people could walk right onto your property and damage it. Having a fence with Mexico we keep out the people we do not want in and we can let people we do want in.
@Frank: I agree with you on the fact that with fences we can keep drug dealers and illegal immigrants out of our country. However we leave the Canadian borders unguarded and they can bring over drugs that are illegal here. Its with the marijuana topic we discussed in class. If we are trying to stop drugs from Mexico coming here then why are we not trying to stop drugs from Canada. Your statement also against your first opinion that fences are inanimate objects and do not do anything.
I don't believe fences make good neighbors. When you put a fence up all you're really saying is you don't trust what's around you. You can even take that down to putting a fence up in your backyard...you put the up so that the dog won't get out because you don't trust your dog. Or you put them up so that no one can get in because you don't trust anyone that you don't know coming onto your private property. If we put a fence between Canada and us it's only going to insult them. It won't make them any happier with us because they'll think we don't trust them that we're on guard towards them. That wouldn't make a very happy neighbor.
responding to rachel:
I disagree. When you put up a fence you are sending a message to the person on the other side of it. It's isn't going to make the other side happy about what you've done. For example, with Mexico. we put the fence up to keep them out..it hasn't really worked. The only way you could really enforce keeping someone out is by threatening them. Even if you did keep them out they're still not good neighbors because they're unhappy therefore they'll hold a grudge against us. And that's only if he fence works, usually it doesn't even work so it's just better to keep them down and keep a happy relationship especially if the fence wasn't even there in the first place, like with Canada.
Elisa, the reason why our border fence system has failed is because we do not have a fence that completely borders the United States-Mexico border. We only have a few fences which run for a mile or two on high immigrant areas. I quote "The border fence is not one continuous structure and is actually a grouping of short physical walls that stop and start, secured in between with "virtual fence" which includes a system of sensors and cameras monitored by Border Patrol Agents."
@Elisa: Don't you want privacy? Fences can insure that. Yes you can say that houses are private enough, but a lot of houses around my area have huge open windows you can see right through. Also with out fences how do you know where your property starts and someone else's stops?
Rachael, Many HOA's do not allow fences. If somebody wants privacy they can install some other form of a visual shield. Shades are a good idea.
no, fences do not make good neighbors, becasue they are not alive. however in the cituation with mexico, they may be necessary for our way of life. becasue without them we would have to many iliegal imigrants, and then the population in the us would go way up. and then the ecomomy would go way down. so fences may be better neighbos then mexico can be.
rachel :)
your piont abotu keeping privacy is absolutly correct. becasue without fences keeping peopel out of trhe US, andyone could just walk in and invade our lives! also i didnt think about how they can help people in, like they could stop criminals from leaving our country to escape!
@ Brandon:
I agreee with you on the situation between the United States and Mexico and the border. It has gotten out of hand and Mexican officials aren't paying attention to the facts.
In my opinion, it is difficult to distinguish whether or not fences make good neighbors. For instance, the construction of a fence could be a sign of distrust or hostility between neighbors. However, since we are discussing the United States and Mexico, it is my belief that a fence is best (our country’s safety is important). For example, as many people have previously stated, numerous illegal immigrants would be able to pass over into the United States without a care. This could lead to many complications, such as the destruction of our economy and overpopulation in certain areas. In conclusion, although fences could provoke aggression, they are often needed to keep people safe.
@ whoever responded to what I said:
Okay, Brandon you win but either..don't you think Mexico or Canada is or would be at least a little bit offended if we put up borders. What is that saying? Basically that we don't trust them.
and rachel well of course i want privacy? why wouldn't i? but if i had to choose between the chances of someone invading my privacy...which isn't likely i mean it isn't like canadians are going to storm down and say "hey whats up" randomly. I mean there are other sources of privacy. Plus putting a fence isn't going to stop all people. I mean think of the 300 million we already have here...anyone could. any way back to what i was saying. if i had to choose between a fence and a good relationship with a neighbor. I 'd choose the neighbor. Although it has helped a lot with illegal immigration i still think that an inanimate object isn't going to do much.
Responding to Rebecca’s first comment. I agree with your position when you stated that fences provide safety (I also included this point in my first response). However, the fact that fences distinguish where properties end did not even cross my mind. Thank you for reminding me of this significant reason. I agree with your entire first response.
andy :)
i didnt think about how it would depend where the fencae is. that is a very good point, becasue if there was a fence between canade and the u.s. it would be almost pointless, becasue we get along with them so well. so in that case a fence would nto be a goood neighbor.
Responding to Elisa’s last comment. Your last comment was very well stated and I agree with you. You replied to Brandon by saying that the construction of fences would give the impression of distrust (which is exactly what I said in my response so I agree). In addition, Rachel asked if you want privacy. I wanted to let you know that I agree with your clever reply that you would rather have a good relationship with a neighbor than privacy. However, what about illegal immigration due to the lack of those fences (I know you admitted that it helps illegal immigration but I would like to know if you still think that risking our economy is more important than the relationship that we have with Mexico)?
I believe that the fence is a good thing because it protects our borders (to a certain extent) and helps us estblish a concrete border with mexico.
I believe that fences make bad borders because they show fear and intimitation of that country A good example of this is the Mexican-Us border
Elisa I completely agree with your comement, in the sense that feneces are a bad thing. They put fear into other country's
Brandon I disagree with you that fences make good neighbours
In response to Andy, I agre with you that in certain situations such as the US Mexico border a fence does make a good neighbir
hogitinIn response to Frank, I agree with you that inmost cases fences are not good neighbors but in certain cases it is needed to keep the U.S. safe
The following websites are sources I forgot to cite.
"AFP: Controversial border fence hot issue in Texas primary." Google. 11 Feb. 2009 http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iCfHOpvN1kc1VDXC3XK6m88gugWA.
"Calderon Likens Fence To Berlin Wall, Mexico's President Elect Calls Both ‘Grave’ Errors; Vicente Fox Says Fence Is An ‘Embarrassment’ - CBS News." CBS News - Breaking News Headlines: Business, Entertainment & World News. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/10/26/world/main2130155.shtml.
"Cutting the Cocaine Flow | Newsweek Politics | Newsweek.com." Newsweek - National News, World News, Health, Technology, Entertainment and more... | Newsweek.com. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.newsweek.com/id/42437/.
"Drug tunnel from Mexico to U.S. found after raids - USATODAY.com." News, Travel, Weather, Entertainment, Sports, Technology, U.S. & World - USATODAY.com. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-06-29-drug-tunnel_n.htm.
"Have Terrorists Crossed?: Border security critics assert no terrorist has ever illegally jumped U.S. borders; they would be wrong :: Other Articles ::." The Investigative Project on Terrorism. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.investigativeproject.org/625/have-terrorists-crossed.
"Illegal aliens murder 12 Americans daily." WorldNetDaily. 11 Feb. 2009 http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53103.
"Numbers of illegal aliens in the U.S. by Fred Elbel - THE AMERICAN RESISTANCE FOUNDATION - Information on immigration counters -." THE AMERICAN RESISTANCE FOUNDATION - a coalition of immigration crime fighters opposing illegal and undocumented immigration, founded by D.A. King. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.theamericanresistance.com/ref/illegal_alien_numbers.html.
"Politics and Immigration." U.S. Border Control Home Page: the right place for stopping illegal immigration anddrug smuggling, reforming our border and immigration policies, and restructuring the INS. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.usbc.org/profiles/2004profiles/0904leakinuss.htm.
"Washington Times - Border patrol agent held at gunpoint." Washington Times - Politics, Breaking News, US and World News. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/aug/06/soldiers-cross-into-us-hold-guns-to-agent/?page=2.
"YouTube - Immigration Hearing 5/10/2007 -- Robert Rector (Heritage)." YouTube - Broadcast Yourself. 11 Feb. 2009 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYzPU0Qmh-I&NR=1.
Post a Comment